Nintendo on learning from Wii U's mistakes with Switch, listening to fans - Nintendo Everything

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Nintendo on learning from Wii U’s mistakes with Switch, listening to fans

Posted on October 9, 2017 by (@NE_Brian) in News, Switch, Wii U

Leading up to the launch of Switch, we often heard about how Nintendo was trying to learn from its mistakes during the Wii U era and applying that knowledge for its new console. With the system having been available for several months, Nintendo of America senior product marketing manager Bill Trinen and Nintendo of America senior VP of sales and marketing Doug Bowser reflected on this subject once again.

Trinen fist weighed in on one important aspect Nintendo addressed: the system menu. Whereas Wii U took quite a while to start up and load a game, Switch is lighting fast in comparison.

Trinen said:

“If you look at the Wii U hardware system, just the system menu itself β€” the time that it took to boot that system up, to get into gameplay β€” was something that was a frustration for a lot of players early on, and actually became a hindrance.”

“With Switch being something that you can take with you, it made it really important that you could play it instantly. That to me is an example of a direct lesson from the Wii U era, where Nintendo said, ‘That’s something we’re gonna zero in on and make a dramatic improvement on.'”

Bowser also spoke about something we’ve heard from Nintendo previously – that being a steady stream of games on Switch:

“We had a glut [of game releases] up front, and then kind of went dry for quite some time. From a first-party perspective at least, we were very intentional and deliberate about Switch. We launched with The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, which obviously was incredibly successful, drove hardware, and brought a bunch of new people into the franchise. And then followed that with ‘Mario Kart,’ straight through the series of games we’ve released since then. That’s been a really important lesson that we’ve applied that seems to have worked.”

Last but not least, Bowser commented on how Nintendo is trying to listen to its fans and response:

“Our goal is to delight our players. We want people to have access to our hardware, to our content, and have great experiences. So we actively read the market and try to understand what those trends are, and make sure we’re adjusting accordingly. We are responding. We’re listening.”

Source, Image source

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  • Dark Rain

    I am really sure that NoA and NoE are listening. The Problem is NoJ.

  • Vigilante_blade

    Here’s what we want, no more motion controls focus. Give. Us. Options.

    • JasonBall

      *you

      • Roto Prime

        <3

      • Vigilante_blade

        And MANY others.

        • JasonBall

          Okay, I guess.

          Can you think of any case in gaming where more options are bad? Or do you think 100% of time as many options as conceivably possible are the best way to go? Does that also apply to game difficulty? Graphical/framerate as in FE Warriors?

          • Vigilante_blade

            I think tha tin the case of divisive thing slike motion cotnrols, they should always be optional and secondary. 100% of games should be playable in full without ever having to use them. Now, that doesn’t mean it cannot exist, just not be forced on people… and especially not be hidden from people until the last minute. When I buy a game, I want to know what I’m getting into.

            Game difficulty… I think that this is more of a gray area. They are an improvement, but not exactly expected. What I will say is that difficulty settings should never be unlockables, as it defeats their purpose. Skills grows over the course of beating a game to unlock it, so the increase in difficulty might no longer be enough by that time. Besides, playing a game that is far too easy for you is frustrating when you want your first time through to be a challenge.

            The framerate options are great. i think that all games should strive for 60 FPS. So letting us reduce graphics to gain better gameplay is good.

          • JasonBall

            That’s mostly fair. I can’t remember if we’ve discussed this before, but what about a mouse in fps PC games? Do you consider that a motion control?

          • Technically a thumbstick is a motion control cuz you gotta move your thumb to control it
            MIND.BLOWN

          • JasonBall

            I wasn’t going to bring that up because that might destabilize him. Was gonna see the mouse inquiry reaction first

          • I only use mind controls
            No motion whatsoever

          • Vigilante_blade

            It takes far more than thaty to destabilize me. I have the feeling that you don’t really have the right perception of me.

          • Vigilante_blade

            You mind was blown a long time ago, mate.

        • BαΊ£o Anh HoΓ ng

          You mean 400 people, the one ok with it is 4.000.000 other people, understood

          • Vigilante_blade

            I don’t understand what you are talking about.

      • MagcargoMan

        He’s gotten what he wanted several times but makes excuses for why they don’t count. Pokken didn’t even force you to use the GamePad he still complained and made up some conspiracy about how they totally would have given the pro-controller less responsiveness in Pokken.

        He doesn’t really care about options. TP HD had no wiimote support, and despite being able to play it motion-control free like how he wanted, he still had the nerve to go and tell someone who wanted a Wiimote + nunchuk option that he didn’t want it.

        • Vigilante_blade

          We said we’d ignore one another, yet you did not respect your side of it. Please do not lie about me. I’ve never told someone that he “didn’t want it”. I told him I thought he wasn’t missing much. Criticcizing me is perfectly fine, but at least be honest.

        • MagcargoMan

          Here’s my only reply. And it’s replying to my own post for the sake of not breaking the deal. The deal was I’d stop replying to you and you’d stop replying to me. Not sure if you’re blind, but the post of mine you replied to was directed at JasonBall and not you.

          And looks like you, unlike me, replied first. So you broke your own deal. Wouldn’t expect any less from a hypocrite like you.

          • JasonBall

            Now now, children. If you really can’t stand each other that bad, block each other so I’m not scrolling past petty “you replied first” whinings

          • Addy

            Blocking is what little kids do. And that is something I don’t do. Because I’m not a little kid, getting mad about an opinion from someone whom you will never likely meet in real life. Talesofbs was right, this place is nothing more then a echochamber filled with mentally challenged imbeciles. I hate all of you.

          • JasonBall

            And you’re here too. <3

          • Addy

            What is with that heart? Get away from me.

          • ShonenJump

            Getting death threads or people constantly replying with hate are the ones getting blocked.

          • Addy

            They can just make another account and still continue their tirade. Also death threats should be reported. That’s why there’s a flagging feature.

          • ShonenJump

            Which i did. But there is something else that happend which i won’t go into.

          • Addy

            Then keep it that way.

          • MagcargoMan

            Shoosh you.

      • RoadyMike
    • GoldenTriforce

      I.. I mean you have had options. So I don’t know what you’re complaining about.

      • Vigilante_blade

        Not always.

        • Aline Piroutek

          Are you talking about Wii Sports club not accepting the Pro Controller?

        • Eagle367

          Hey vigilante blade you changed your profile pic so didn’t recognize you. How’s it been I have been really busy with studies my uni started and it’s been pretty hectic.

      • ShonenJump

        Well some wii games didn’t have a option

    • awesomeparadise3

      What motion control games are there that don’t give you options?

      • Vigilante_blade

        Remember breath of the Wild shrines?

        • Androzz

          wow, are you seriously complaining about some puzzles that are optional?

          • Vigilante_blade

            Why wouldn’t I? I foudn them annoying to do, and they could have easily allowed me to do it with modern controls. Besides, they are not optional if you are a completionist. A truly optional feature is one that can entirely be skipped for 100% completion.

          • SpectralDynamite

            100% completetion is an optional undertaking in and of itself. The hell are you on about? 99.75% of the game is alright as is. Blowing up the remaining .25% to make it like the end of the world as we know it is pointless.

          • Vigilante_blade

            It’s not. “optional” is something that you can skim over and lose absolutely nothing from the core experience. If an item is locked behind a motion control section, then it is not optional.

          • SpectralDynamite

            Getting all the Spirit Orbs isn’t necessary for the core experience. You lose nothing from skipping the, what… THREE out of 40 times that number of shrines. You aren’t truly any worse off for it and if that kills the game as a whole for you, then that is your problem and yours alone. Nowhere near as big of an issue as you’re making it out to be.

          • Vigilante_blade

            However, it is necessary is you want a certain piece of gear. You lose out on it. You also lose out on a potential heart or stamina container. It is four, not three. As I am a completionist, this is forced on me.

            Again, somethign is only TRULY optional if one can 100% the game without it. I have already established what I mean by the use of that term. Now, you are simply being pedantic.

        • angiovitta

          So your argument that Nintendo isn’t giving us options is the fact that one game that was a leftover Wii U game in first place that has mandatory motion controls in 0,5% of it’s content?

          Are you trying to be cynical here?

          • Vigilante_blade

            Well, Super Mario Odyssey is still not certain whether it provides non-motion options. 1, 2 Switch is a motion only game. I will give them that ARMS and Splatoon 2 did right by their consummers, albeit I wish that Splatoon 2 fixed its stick dead zones. Star Fox Zero, Paper Mario Colour Splash, Tokyo Mirage Sessions and Xenoblade X are pretty recent exmaples of gimmicks being forced one way or another. So yes, I don’t trust Nintendo yet on the matter. If they can prove me wrong, however, then I will change my tune.

            And no, I sincerely wish I could be excited for video games again.

          • Tracy Bowersox

            You… you want a non-motion version of 1 2 Switch?

          • Vigilante_blade

            Nah, that game sucks. Just saying that the assertion that all games have options nowadays is untrue.

          • SpectralDynamite

            Yes. Yes, he is. That’s kind of his MO.

        • I remember every second of Breath of the Wild being an intense, erupting sensation of joy and wonder

          • Vigilante_blade

            You are kind of a self-proclaimed fanatic though.

          • You have severe mental problems bro

          • Vigilante_blade

            Coming from you?

          • then i would know for sure, wouldn’t i

          • Aline Piroutek

            Now Uncle Phil is a good man.

          • Eagle367

            This place has a lot of ups and downs. Even Hermione the troll has changed

          • SpectralDynamite

            Damn. Got him there.

        • masterjedi

          Couldn’t you just turn motion controls off and then use the analog stick on a pro controller for those shrines?

          • Vigilante_blade

            No, you are not allowed to. in fact, if playing on Wii U, they actually ask you to go get your Gamepad. I fplaying on Switch, you must use the pro’s gyro.

          • masterjedi

            Well I guess that’s unfortunate for you and players like you who do not want to use motion controls in any way, shape or form. I can understand the frustration if you’ve only ever played with button and analog controls but in my opinion, that is the way of progress. I grew up using the d-pad to move my character around in every game. There are very few games that offer me the option to move my character around with a d-pad now.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Motion controls aren’t really an evolution though. It’s mroe of a mutation. There is no reason whatsover to not provide options to play without them.

          • Tracy Bowersox

            They are as much an evolution as the analog stick was.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Nah, sticks are just 8 pronged D-pads, an answer to our switch to 3D gaming. Motion controls serve no evolutionary purpose but to be a gimmick to grab attention. They also limit the way some gaqmes can be played, unlike sticks.

          • JasonBall

            Sticks can also be a limitation

          • Vigilante_blade

            Not exactly, there is no genre of game that cannot be done with sticks.

          • Typing games
            Fitness games

          • Vigilante_blade

            Fitness is not really a gaming genre. It’s mor eof an app than anything. As for typing, sure, it’s doable. Is it the best method? Nah, but doable.

          • Yeah as long as we excise the things that directly contradict your flatly erroneous statement, then your conclusion will make perfect sense.

            Your feelings are not facts, honey. Analog thumbsticks are not the end-all be-all of video game controls. They’re not even good for controlling shooters.

          • Vigilante_blade

            My statements are kinda factual though righ tnow. Plus, mouse controls are beter than motion cotnrols, so just enable mouse controls.

          • ghost phoenix

            isnt moving a mouse motion based….. its like saying the right joycon on the switch while attached isnt motion controls. newsflash if you remove the right joycon while in a gyro game it works like a free floating mouse

          • Vigilante_blade

            No gamers calls it motion controls, therefore it is not motion controls. You move your hands to tap a D-pad, move a stick, press a button, etc… But calling thes emotion cotnrols would be a stretch, as you are doing now.

          • ghost phoenix

            the d-pad is significantly different you move your hand to press a button on a mouse your movement determines where the cursor is or in FPS the aiming reticle so it is therefore by anyone with a half a brains logic motion controls and no amount of your idiocracy can change the fact that i just schooled you in your own subject therefore if your a pc gamer you must love motion controls if you even play with a mouse and keyboard

          • Vigilante_blade

            I am pretty sure you have done no such thing as “school me” on the topic. You have failed to counter any of my arguments. Would you call a car’s steering wheel motion controls? Would you call a TV remote motion controls? You are making way too much of a stretch. So gamer calls mouse and keyboard motion controls other than those who try to justify them. Also, capitalizing those sentences might help your credibility. Just a little tip.

          • ghost phoenix

            oh also by your logic no one calls vehicles by their correct name we generalize them all as cars but that doesnt mean a truck isnt a truck or a van isnt a van and if i looked hard enough i could find someone to tell you a mouse is motion controls and to put it frank the wiimote was a glorified mouse a literal cursor you used on a screen that had to be moved by your hand thank you and good day

          • Vigilante_blade

            Buddy, what you just said can’t even be debated against because it makes no sense.

          • JasonBall

            How would you do a game where you have to drag things with the touch screen very quickly? There’s a microgame in WarioWare Touched where you have to keep pulling Metroids off of Samus, or the minigame in sm64ds where you have to separate different colored whatever’s into different boxes. You just can’t be that fast with sticks.

          • Vigilante_blade

            I wouldn’t make a game with such… Weak design. However. Cursor at high sensitivity and drag away with stick. Could also tap a button to quickly.toggle between targets and yanks with stick. However, I don’t really value Wario Ware as a console.title and it should be put on smart devices instead.

          • JasonBall

            That’s fair

          • Radish

            So do you think VR games should not use motion controls?

          • ghost phoenix

            no evolutionary purpose huh guess you didnt know the gyroscope is what tells your smart phone which way is up and which way is down or that literally without some type of gyro sensor your ps4 and xbox one controller would have no input as to how your holding it it for FPS games look it up everything has gyro sensors in it these days even if the games dont support motion controls they are still always there next your going to tell me that vr is garbage. VR AR and Motion controls are the same thing and will only become more relevant. also you couldnt have touch screens without motion controls

          • Vigilante_blade

            I know, and the gyroscope on my phone sometimes screws me over. But a phone is not a gaming console.

            And yes, I consider VR to be an untennable concept. It makes me violently ill, and I keep hearing people say the same. It already has failed as a concept an it now niche…. like motion controls.

          • Tracy Bowersox

            You seem to have just said analog sticks added nothing new to gaming, being just 8 pronged d pads. Motion controls, however, allow for fast pointer controls, something sticks or d pads have never accomplished. So I revise my statement. Motion controls are a more significant evolution than the analog stick.

          • Vigilante_blade

            The stick has allowed easier navigation in a 3D environment. They were instrumental to 3D games taking off. They have existed since the 70’s, and Sega also made the first self-centering one for Space Harrier. Even better, controls sticks provided no drawbacks, Motion controls certainly did.

          • masterjedi

            You say that because you don’t like them. I know tons of gamers who prefer motion controls for first person shooters and would never opt to use button/analog controls in lieu of motion controls. I imagine you must be against VR as well seeing as how that entire gaming medium is based on motion controls? Because in my opinion, nobody can claim that moving your hand in mid air and having that somehow translated to a screen in front of you isn’t progress or evolution. Just like the analog stick was progress/evolution of the d-pad.

          • Vigilante_blade

            I also know a ton of gamers who hate motion controls. They are divisive, and you cannot deny this. If something is divisive, make it optional.

            I actually dislike VR, but not just because of motion controls. I literally cannot see the 3D effect well and it makes me violently ill.

            I don’t consider motion controls an evolution, but a mutation. While playing with an SNES controller and a Gamecube controller is an extremely similar experience (sit on couch, press buttons, and move), motion controls are enough of a change so that some who might like the former may not enjoy the latter.

          • ShonenJump

            Motion control was a gimmick that worked well. When you first time played with Wii remote it was great! But then it becomes a bore and then you think why do some games doesn’t have option to have traditional controllers. I loved how it worked well with Mario galaxy and skyward sword. But i also wanted to have a traditional way to play instead of always 1 motion controlled way. I see vr right now more as a experiment that needs to be fleshed out. Though i did enjoy job simulator!

          • masterjedi

            You don’t like motion controls so you want an option to play without them, but you seem to be completely fine with the fact that playing with the d-pad is not an option for most games. Have you any idea how divisive the analog stick was when it came out? Lots of gamers were unhappy with the change from the tried and true, proven to work d-pad to some weird stick. Touch controls were the same way. Nobody who played the Gameboy, Gameboy Advance or the Gameboy Color could imagine being forced to touch the screen in order to play but that’s exactly what happened. Now we have an entire generation of gamers (seemingly like yourself) who could not imagine being restricted to playing with the d-pad or not having the ability to simply swipe the screen to make something happen while an entire generation of gamers like me simply had to accept the changes and adapt. Motion control gaming is the same way. If everything divisive was made optional, I’d still be able to play every game with the d-pad and without touch screen controls.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Analogue sticks are not divisive and were quickly accepted. Motion controls were not. Touch controls are also divisive and were never fully accepted. Alternatively, a control stick is merely an evolution of the D-pad. It is a mechanical input. Not to mention that control sticks existed since the 70’s.

            Again, control sticks were “never” divisive.

          • masterjedi

            One of the main complaints about the Nintendo 64 controller was the fact that the d-pad was hard to reach and people wanted to use that to move their characters around instead of the analog stick. Your argument that analog sticks were never divisive is based on your personal bias in favor the analog stick. Your claim that motion controls were not quickly accepted is based on your bias against motion control gaming. The Wii (a predominantly motion controlled gaming device) is the second best selling home game console of all time. Over 100 million people accepted motion control gaming in a span of 6 years. You say touch controls were never fully accepted but the DS (based heavily around touch input technology) sold over 150 million. You seem to be of the mind that an evolution in gaming control schemes must be a forward progress in the same medium i.e. a mechanical input must remain some kind of mechanical input otherwise it doesn’t count. I disagree with this notion. I believe the way a game is controlled encompasses any state of evolution so mechanical inputs becoming motion inputs is an evolution of gaming input control as far as I’m concerned. And if you want to got back in history to solidify your argument that analog sticks were quickly accepted, then we must also acknowledge the fact that motion controls have been around for 36 years.

          • Vigilante_blade

            I prefer the D-pad for some things. However, the stick is better fir others. And the D-pad did not go away, a stark difference with the Wiimote. And games that used to use the D-pad now continues to use the D-pad. One good thing that happened in recent years is Nintendo providing D-pad options in most games. However, sticks were immediately accepted.

            Motion controls are factually divisive. I am a living proof of that. The PS4’s success and failure of Kinect is also proof of that. You claim that my biad colours my judgement, but I could use the argument against you. Your positive bias towards motion inputs blinds you to its shortcomings and its criticism. Hangning out mostly in Nintendo communities exposes you tol an overwhelmingly positive outlook on Nintendo that isn’t representative of general gaming population. You see, claiming someone has bias is pointless. No person is born in a vaccum. You are every bit as biased s the people you accuse of bias. Besides, bias cannot be proven unless you can read one’s mind.

            Many peoole bought DS consoles and did not play games that used touch. I avoided them like a plague. I bought a Wii U and did not use the gamepad. I bought a Wii (with deep regret) and only bought pro controller gsmes. A sale does not equal enjoyement. A lot of people bought Fire Emblem Fates and really did not enjoy it.

            I acknowledge that the Wiimote is essentially a Powerglove. It did not appeal to me back then, and it doesn’t appeal to me now. Many feel the way I do.

          • masterjedi

            I never claimed to be without bias. I enjoy motion controls now but I struggled mightily with them when I initially bought my Wii. The difference is your comments are very hard line and show that you are not willing to apply your argument equally to a scenario that goes against your bias.

            “Every game should offer the option to play without motion controls” I retorted that that option was not feasible.

            “There is no reason why every game should not offer the option to play without motion controls.” I first said that is very expensive to make multiple control schemes for every game, and as technology advances, certain old technology just gets left behind. To support my argument, I brought up the example of the d-pad and how it is no longer used for character movement in many games and asked why you seem not to have a problem with that.

            “If it is divisive, it should be optional.” I responded with the argument that the analog stick was divisive when it replaced the d-pad for movement.

            “Control sticks were never divisive while motion controls are divisive.” Your proof of that argument seems to hinge on the fact that you prefer control sticks over motion controls and you know many other people who feel the same way. I responded with the argument that I myself struggled to adapt to the analog stick when I was first exposed to it and would have preferred to play using the d-pad and I know many others who felt the same way. I then offered the amount of Wii/DS sales as further proof that there were far more people than just those I knew who seemed like they either liked the motion/touch controls or adapted to them. I find it hard to believe that after year one of those systems being on the market, people were still purchasing them and purchasing games for them only to be surprised that the control schemes were built around motion/touch control technology. You can look at the software sales to see how widely accepted motion/touch controls were. People didn’t buy Wii Play because they thought they’d be able to use analog controls on it, they knew exactly what kind of control scheme that game was built around. Nearly 30 million people bought that game knowing exactly what it was. The Wiimote didn’t go away either, it evolved into the joy cons. Look at the motion controls for bow shooting is Skyrim, you are using the joy cons in the same way that the wiimote and nunchuck were used.

            “The analog/control stick is the evolution of the d-pad so its fine.” I responded with the argument that motion controls were then the evolution of the analog stick because they were a new, more advanced method of controlling movement in games.

            “Motion controls are not an evolution, they are a mutation because there is no mechanical input.”

            My point is no matter what evidence you are presented with, you seem able to find a reason to justify your preference because you have that bias. I am able to extrapolate your bias based on your comments just as you are able to extrapolate mine. Please understand I’m not trying to convince you that motion controls are better, I just want to understand how you can be okay with the analog stick being forced on a gamer like me who grew up with the d-pad but you are not okay with motion controls being forced on you because you prefer the analog stick? Your original point was “Every game should have the option to play without motion controls because motion controls are divisive.” If you believe that to be the case, how can you say that every game should NOT have to offer the option to play with the d-pad? And I’m not talking about d-pad functionality where the different buttons on the d-pad perform specific actions, I’m talking about moving my character around in a game. There are literally hundreds of games out there that do not offer me that option and its not limited to Nintendo games. In Assassin’s Creed IV on the 360, movement is tied to the L analog stick while their version of the d-pad is used to switch between weapons and items. There’s no option to move my character around in the game with the 360 version of the d-pad. I believe you are fine with something like this because you believe the analog stick is a natural evolution of game functionality from the d-pad and therefore everyone should be able to get used to it or adapt to it. You do not see motion controls that same way, (because you have a bias against them) and therefore in your mind people should NOT have to get used to them or adapt to them. Its totally fine that that is your opinion, but realize that it is YOUR opinion and it is based on a bias that you have that is in favor of mechanical input as opposed to motion inputs.

            Your argument essentially boils down to I don’t like motion controls and I shouldn’t be forced to use them but you guys who prefer the d-pad to the analog stick should adapt because that’s natural evolution. I think that’s why you’re getting some of the heated responses your getting. It feels like you are dismissing any view that isn’t yours.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Send me shorter responses. I have dozen if email notificatiins every few minutes and I am at work. Otherwise, I cannot take the time for you.

        • jyushi

          You made a point and I agree with you. The puzzles that you have to use motion control was so annoying, I want to skip it but I need to finish them all. I managed to solve it but it would be great if you have an option to solve the puzzle without relying on motion control.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Indeed. I don’t know why many find this so unreasonable.

          • jyushi

            Hahaha… yeah. Sometimes people treat their favorite company like a religion, they will go hostile when someone points out the flaws or when someone voice his/her critics toward the company. You have right to tell your opinion and opinion is subjective, you have a different preference, I have a different preference but we have to learn to respect others’ opinion. I could disagree with you on some certain points or vice versa and that’s okay. πŸ˜‰

          • Vigilante_blade

            Yeah, I have had many talks with Fandangle for example where we vehemently disagreed. I still talk to him regularily now.

          • MagcargoMan

            “Sometimes people treat their favorite company like a religion, they will go hostile when someone points out the flaws or when someone voice his/her critics toward the company. ”
            Sounds eerily similar to what a bunch of people are like regarding a certain fighting game on the GameCube from 2001…

          • ghost phoenix

            just wondering which of those companys you favor as a religion the one literally selling your credit card info to the highest bidder claiming they were hacked (Sony) or the one forcing you to give up your personal information to the highest advertiser so they can make even more money than they are with just selling you an incomplete OS. (microsoft) or the one that has had fans since the 80’s divded into liking them or hating them but still get record number number of console sales (whether good or bad its still a record) year after year and has the biggest selling first party franchises because of said division of liking the company. oh and i should mention nintendo has never had a security breach never been hacked never lost CC info of consumers.

          • jyushi

            I’m a Nintendo player since the 80’s and still a fan. Xbox definitely not in my list since it lacks of exclusive titles (as far as I know). Both Nintendo and Sony have intriguing exclusive titles. So far, Switch is my favorite console.

            What I hate is the fandom, like some Sony/Xbox gamers feel more superior than Nintendo gamers. Or PC vs console is also annoying. For me, gaming is all about fun no matter what is your gaming platform.

          • What sup Jyushi would like join our unofficial NE discord server. We’re a community of Nintendo gamers, I think you can contribute with our daily topics, discuss and debating. If you are interested in the future to join us the link is on my profile. Good day!

          • Hello Jyushi you would like join our unofficial NE discord server. We’re a community of Nintendo gamers, I think you can contribute with our daily topics, discuss and debating. If you are interested in the future to join us the link is on my profile. Good day!

    • DiscoGentleman

      I’d agree with you 10 years ago, but right now? There are options in motion games released by nintendo. What non-argument are you trying to start?

      • Vigilante_blade

        Not all of them.

        • masterjedi

          Are there games for Switch that do not allow you to use the pro controller?

        • DiscoGentleman

          Not trying to argue, but other than 1 2 Switch, I can’t think of what recent game Nintendo has released with motion controls that doesn’t have button controls, too.
          Care to back your comment up?

          • Vigilante_blade

            Zelda Breath of the Wild has force motion controls during four frustrating shrines, and you cannot turn them off. I consider this a significant game. Furthermore, people who have played the Super Mario Odyssey demo hav enot been able to find non-motion alternatives to some abilities.

          • BαΊ£o Anh HoΓ ng

            And that make game become terrible or something?

          • Fredy Rodriguez Ortega

            you should hate this ones in real life eh

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ball-in-a-maze_puzzle

          • Vigilante_blade

            I don’t really mind those. That isn’t a video game.

          • ghost phoenix

            breath of the wild was developed for wii u which forced motion controls on all its games the reason BOTW was delayed is the switch was announced they wanted a big franchise opening for the switch so they delayed the game. if you remember the switch was supposed to be released in 2016 but they delayed it so they could optimize more games for its release. BOTW was not optimized and if you actually look deep into it youd find that nintendo themselves dont like the shrines with motion controls however theres no way to release to dlc that could get rid of them because it stops a game breaking glitch found in aplpha testing where the ball would literally clip through the floor and never reload and from what ik there are plans in thge future for a free update to give you the option to complete that sewt of shrines without motion controls

          • Vigilante_blade

            Actually, it would be very easy. Mapping the tilt to a stick would in fact be ridiculously easy.

          • ghost phoenix

            except your forgetting one thing hardware capability you’d rather have the entire hardware changed so the game registers it as a stick control which even on the pro controller for the switch is touchy to the degree that moving it an inch moves link a whole 3 steps then deal with the precision of motion personally until nintendo makes a good stick motion is the better option for them now if motion makes you queazy then dont play video games 100% of them involve motion

          • Vigilante_blade

            It doesn’t change the fact that it is ridiculously easy. Also, you need to stop making crazy stretches. Yes, you move to play games, but when people refer to motion controls, they talk about motion involving sensors, cameras, gyros, etc… Not moving your hand.

          • ghost phoenix

            a mouse has an optical or laser sensor to figure out where its traction is based on the “sensors” position from where it is currently to where it will be just the same as a wii remote or any other motion control device has a sensor to determine movement based on optics or infrared or laser sensors best example being the right joycon on the switch it has a “camera” that senses the distance from your body to the ground to the console just as mouse has a sensor that senses movement based on how long it takes the signal to be read back to the device and relay it to the computer. has a sensor that senses movement a tv remote does not sense movement a mouse however does therefore it would be motion controls. i also noticed you said nothing about how i baically proved what i said with a wii remote which is literally a glorified mouse

          • Vigilante_blade

            Again, we are not using the same definitions. I use the term in the way gamers define it. You twist the definition around to fit your narrative.

            PC gamers call mouse and keyboard controls, mouse and keyboard. Not motion controls. You can’t arbitrarily decided that the whole of the gaming community is wrong when they create the lingo.

          • ghost phoenix

            actually i asked about 10 other “gamers” as you would put it 9/10 of them think a mouse is a form of motion control dont believe me go ask some people on twitch who literally play games for a living

          • Vigilante_blade

            10 is a terrible samole size. Plus, you didn’t tell me who answered the question and where they came from.i can easily ask people and a website that isn’t nintendo only and they will tell me otherwise.

    • Ragnell

      Uhh… what happened to ur Roy avatar!?

      • DeltaPeng

        Roy’s not his boy anymore

        • Vigilante_blade

          Roy is always my boy. Soren is my kitten though.

          • Ragnell

            I just unlocked my Soren to 5* in heroes. He’s still at level 1 though. Sorry the son of *spoilers*.

    • Vigilante_blade

      In befor emor epeople get triggered and I hold month long discussions where people try to convince me that I should like motion controls, and make light of the problem instead of being capable of using basic level empathy.

      • Velen (Not WoW)

        Look who’s talking. You lack the ability to empathize with anyone who doesn’t hold a viewpoint similar to your own.

      • Vigilante_blade

        Also, Velen, I can’t read what you said, but I would appreciate you stop stlaking me when I can’t even respond to you.

        • Velen (Not WoW)

          Stalking you? Oh please. Stop being melodramatic. Most of the time I barely comment at you anymore and spend most of my time commenting to others.

          You thinking I’m stalking you is a delusion you’ve set up.

      • Boo Nintendo, how dare you have an idea for a shrine and want to actually use a consoles defuault controller capabilites.

        I understand options. I also understand that devs have ideas and ways they want players to experience things. Maybe you don’t like those ideas – and that’s fine. Be critical.

        But Nintendo likes motion controls so it’s obviously going to be something they are going to use.

        As for “modern controls” – twin stick gaming isnt modern. It’s standard. Motion controls are actually newer and more modern than twin sticks. Doesn’t mean you have to like them.

        Instead of chastising the whole of Nintendo, give critical, constructive, feedback aimed at Eiji Aonuma.

        YOU won’t convince Nintendo on the whole to abandon motion. They like it. Some other gamers like it. They have a right to enjoy it.

        And let’s reserve judgment of a yet to be released game until at least reviews land.

        Just because people playing a demo couldn’t figure it out doesn’t t mean the option doesn’t exist. It could even be in the settings that aren’t accessible in the demo.

        • Vigilante_blade

          You realize that the entire thing can easily be mapped to a stick? Whya re you against the option existing?

      • SpectralDynamite

        You opened this can of worms, not us.

        • Vigilante_blade

          I’m not the one who went balaistic because someone doesn’t like motion controls. You simply can’t fathom that I don’t want that gimmick, so you keep epstering me with month long discussions.

          • SpectralDynamite

            No, I can’t fathom that you can’t accept that said “gimmick” has a right to exist and more people than you’re willing to acknowledge actually enjoy using it. It’s not that you don’t want it; you don’t respect it at all.

            Besides, I don’t spend months on end arguing with you. I leave that to the others. I typically only step in when you say something truly ridiculous or unnecessary… which happens more often than expected.

          • Vigilante_blade

            I’ve not said it doesn’t have a right to exist. Again, Spectral, you force words into my mouth. I demand options to be able to turn it off, and you’re trying to force it down my throat. You can’t accept that I and many others clearly don’t enjoy using those, and try to force your opinion on me. You are falsely accusing me of doing something you are doing to me,

            I’ll be perfectly honest here. I know some people are still pissed off I left their discord, but let it go.

          • Radish

            And yet all of the top Splatoon players use motion controls. Still just a gimmick? I will think of you on the day that the best Smash player uses motion controls. The irony is I probably use less motion playing Splatoon with motion controls than you using analog sticks. It’s THAT subtle. It’s come a long way and you just can’t admit it.

          • MagcargoMan

            Lol, he hasn’t bothered replying to any mention of that thing about the pro-players. Looks like he’s afraid to admit it.

          • Radish

            It’s because he has me blocked. So I don’t think he doesn’t see anything I say. But that won’t stop me from responding to him when I have reason to. :>

          • BαΊ£o Anh HoΓ ng

            Said that to Nintendo, complain here won’t make game become what you want

    • Mark

      After experiencing motion-control aiming in Zelda, I never want to go back. Far more precise and fast.

      • Vigilante_blade

        I disagree, but that aside, how does that couunter my point that all games should have an option to turn it off?

        • Mark

          I’m not trying to counter you or argue, I’m just saying that they’ve used it very well with far more precise action and no waggle. Motion controls have a place in modern gaming.

          • Vigilante_blade

            All right, but I disagree. I feel they have never been used well and are extremely imprecise. Sure, motion controls have a place as an option, secondary input.

          • Bart

            git gud scrub πŸ˜‰

          • Vigilante_blade

            Please, I can actually capitalize my sentences.

          • Bart

            πŸ˜‰

          • Mark

            Do you ever anticipate more lifelike controls becoming more acceptable in gaming? Like, in 25 years, do you anticipate we’ll still be using joysticks and buttons in our new interfaces? Or do you think that motion control is just too soon?

          • Vigilante_blade

            I think motion controls are already pretty much over. They became niche halfway throughout the Wii’s lifespan. Microsoft killed the kinect, VR uses motion controls, but it hasn’t taken on. Motion cotnrols failed as an experiment and only a very vocal subset of Nintendo gamers, the kind that follow blogs, still care about them in any capacity.

          • That’s true typically at first. But if you get over how weird it feels and actuslly work at it, motion control aiming is unobjectively faster and more precide in every game that has it.

            They literally had to seperate Wiimote users from game pad users in black ops 2 on Wii U because Wiimote users were wrecking twin stick players and it was deemed an unfair advantage. In Splatoon 2, all the top players use motion and even the ones who didn’t eventually worked at it later and realized just how much faster and more accurate it is.

            I say this as a stick user in the 2nd game. I get how weird it feels and how hard it is to get out of your comfort zone. I’m having a hard time doing it so I keep turning it off.

            But if I put in the time and work, I ultimately know it’s faster and more accurate and you can tell while playing.

            I appreciate your preference and what your accustomed too. But the accuracy of motion controls isn’t even a debate. It’d a fact.

            Your preference of not wanting to change how you have gamed for years is just blocking you from it.

          • Dunnington

            I played the original Splatoon without motion controls (over 100 hours), and started playing 2 without them. It took me a while to get used to them, but I’m definitely better now than I was before. Playing the game without motion controls now feels much slower and more inaccurate. I liked them in Breath of the Wild for things like aiming my bow, but I will admit the shrines were annoying and a bit much. I think that motion controls are going to continue to be evolved an refined.

          • JasonBall

            Well said Nate, good to see you here joining on one of our monthly giant arguments about motion.

          • JasonBall

            They’re faster, if not more precise

          • Vigilante_blade

            They are not more precise, we all know that.

          • JasonBall

            I don’t know that. I do also know they’re faster. OoT horseback archery. MM swamp archery.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Sure, you can move fast, but if they let you alter stick sensitivity and speed, that would just sticks just as much speed. And you’d have the unrivaled precision (except for mouse) of sticks.

          • JasonBall

            A mouse movement is a motion control

          • Vigilante_blade

            No, it clearly is not. When gamer sspeak of motion controls, they speak of gyro sensors, tilt and waggle stuff. A mouse actually isn’t a motion device in any gamer definition. No self-respecting PC gamer calls it motion controls.

          • JasonBall

            You move your arm around to use it. Why does it matter what’s inside

          • Vigilante_blade

            We use definitions that gamers use.

          • JasonBall

            That doesn’t answer me. You use motion with a mouse. Why do you like it.

          • Vigilante_blade

            A mouse is flat on a surface, and thus, far more stable. With a motion controller, you don’t get that amount of stability. Furthermore, this is a wired signal, so no input lag. Furthermore, this isn’t an actual motion device. It is mechanical in nature.

            I don,t particularily like it, I prefer controllers, but I can respect it because it works, isn’t a motion device, and has advantages.

          • JasonBall

            Wireless mice are becoming very common, but that sounds fair.

            I’m pretty stable holding a wiimote though, and if someone were twitchy, it being on a surface wouldn’t help.

          • Radish

            The problem here is that Vigilante_blade thinks motion controls are still in the Wii era and doesn’t acknowledge how much they’ve evolved over the years.

            I probably use less motion using motion controls playing Splatoon than he does moving his thumbs. It’s so subtle now you don’t even think about it. That was the dream when I first heard about motion controls well over a decade ago. Feels natural for aiming.

          • JasonBall

            Precisely

          • Vigilante_blade

            I don’t know anyone who can remain still for hours, personally. In my case, I won’t go into details of why, but prolonged stillness can cause me pain as well. It’ snot exactly that I “can’t” tolerate it, but it is just an added annoyance.

          • JasonBall

            Then why are you anti-motion

          • Vigilante_blade

            Not sure what you mean: Here are ten reasons from the top of my head. I can probably scrounge up more if you’d like….

            1. Often causes problems for left-handed people.
            2. It is not accurate, no matter what people say.
            3. It is prone to signal interference.
            4. It adds input lag.
            5. It gets fidgety, staying motionless is not possible.
            6. It is not always responsive.
            7. They don’t always let us turn it off.
            8. You can’t just sit on a couch and relax passively.
            9. It breaks my immersion,
            10. I just don’t enjoy using them. I don’t need to justify myself on the matter. I just don’t like it. I’m not having fun with it. I find the act of moving while playing a game to be a frustrating experience at its worse, and an unrewarding experience at best. I don’t understand people asking me to justify myself, trying to force me to use them, and being so against OPTIONS to turn them off, then turning aorund and accusing me of trying to take them away from them. I just want an option to not use them and play in peace without some elitist fool berating me due to my personal preference. No, I don’t have to justify my tastes, and no, I don’t have to like them. And no, it shouldn’t be normal for harassement based on preferences to be a thing in this community.

          • JasonBall

            I mean if you have pain holding still I’d think you’d be happy with motion.

            It is accurate for me no matter what you say, and I never notice lag. Wireless controllers of any kind are just as likely to, though. Are you also against normal controllers being wireless?

            I am against options if the game is worse with options. I think a game should stick with a control scheme even if it limits accesability, because a game is best when it is designed around a specific control scheme.

            We hound you about it because clearly, we are a mob of single-minded mechanical thought police that must assimilate you into the collective because we cannot accept outside thinking.

            You stir this stuff up on public forums, man. Yes, you do, with posts like the one you made here and the one on the Sunshine article about your preorder. Harassment shouldn’t happen, but if you know it will, complaining about motion anyways and then getting irked you’re harassed isn’t very productive or smart. If it’s because you want to get Nintendo attention, you know darn well this is not a place they visit. Try tweeting at the half dozen Treehouse members that actually read every tweet sent to them. And keep doing it.

            If you want to play in peace, by all means. It doesn’t irk me you play without motion, it irks me you bring it up in the way you do all the time.

          • Vigilante_blade

            No, I am in pain trying not to move to not activate motion inputs. I can always move my hands around on a non-motion controller and sit in any way I want. I can rest my controlle ron my lap for example.

            You may not notice lag, but it invariably exists. I prefer wired, but there is also the fact that motion controllers happen to have “more” lag that regular wireless controllers. The motion needs to be interpreted as an input, and that time adds to the lag.

            “I am against options if the game is worse with options. I think a game should stick with a control scheme even if it limits accesability, because a game is best when it is designed around a specific control scheme.”

            But without options, it makes the game worse for me and anyone who isn’t into motion gaming. I also think that you surely enjoy many games made with traditional controls in mind, so it’s a non-issue.

            “She was assaulted because she was wearing a sexy outfit”. You comment is the equivalent of that. THis harassement I’m getting right now is pretty insane IMO. It speaks to the sorry state of this fandom. And I am tweeting Nintendo. However, I will take every off chance to make my opinion public. It shouldn’t bother anyone. You are free to do so as well…

            I bring the issue up all of the time because I often end up buying a game, then realizing halfway that a motion thing is forced on me because Nintendo wasn’t up front about it. Then I lost money on the game, money that only allow sme to buy one game every other month. FUrthermore, while you may enjoy motion contorls, I do not, and it is in my best interest to demand options. There is no bad side to my demand.

          • JasonBall

            Yes, there is bad. Some games can become worse with too many options. Yes, I enjoy many games with buttons only. That is irrelevant. I didn’t get upset there wasn’t an option to to use wiimote motion controls in TPHD. Do you think there should have been that option?

            I wouldn’t say being assaulted is ever okay, but if a chick is catcalled and she’s wearing no top, that’s on her. People should be smart enough to know what provokes people. Here in California, we had some conservative speakers scheduled to speak at a liberal University, and students started breaking stuff. So they pulled the speakers. Antagonizing people is a thing easily foreseen. They shouldn’t break things, but people knew they would, so they cancelled the events. You can’t dissuade the masses from anything, and you look silly trying to do so here.

            So, you’re in pain holding a wiimote still but not in pain holding a pro controller still? Sounds fishy.

            This is not the place to get your opinion noticed. Nintendo does not check here. Please tell me you know this. And if you want to spread word of mouth to get your message out, you know this isn’t the place either. No one here will carry your message on positively. So why bother. Does it really infuriate you that much that you have to complain about it everywhere? Do you comment on other sites like this? Do other sitegoers react the same there?

            We’re all just so baffled, dumbfounded, confused, stumped, at the way you say you lost money on a game if you realize it has forced inputs that aren’t buttons or sticks. Mainly we bother you because we don’t understand how you can be so anti-passionate.

          • JasonBall

            I think a gyro is better for aiming.

          • I think a gyro is also better for eating

          • JasonBall

            LOL!!

          • Velen (Not WoW)

            Ha! xD

          • MagcargoMan

          • jon tron is a despicable racist

          • MagcargoMan

            Triggered

          • remember when jontron got told he was a racist and they took him out of a video game and a thousand white fanboys were triggered

            that was the best

            let’s do that again

          • They’re deffo more precise, because the degree to which you can move your thumb is much smaller than the degree you can move YOUR ENTIRE ARM

            Sometimes I feel like you’re just here to convince people how great wiimotes are

    • Devlind

      There are other options. One is called PS4 πŸ˜‰

      • Vigilante_blade

        E.g. “Go away”. Again, another demonstraiton of what is wrong with this fanbase.

        • DeltaPeng

          Well, he did give a wink, so he’s being facetious.

          • Vigilante_blade

            But does it have Nintendo franchise games?

    • Exy

      Options are overrated. Nintendo knows what’s best for you and you don’t.

      • Vigilante_blade

        Big brother Nintendo doesn’t want you to do anything the way you want to.

    • RoadyMike

      https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/241f5e26d21db512a422884e812b65f786bdf63ab6af62826596ed04ba0ea36b.jpg You’re still pretending to be the voice of all gamers/Nintendo fans? Oh wait, you go by “the majority” now. I thought you grew out of this Blade

      • Vigilante_blade

        Nit exactly majority per se since I haven’t dobe research on the matter. But it is undeniable that there are people who dislike motion controls and they are significant enough to be heard.

  • Ramon

    We still need the Virtual Console!

    • cloud36426

      This ^ +10000000!

      • Roto Prime

        I ^ +1000000000 your +10000000!

    • AdriΓ‘n Alucard

      Yeah, let us pay for the same NES games for the third or fourth time

      • Jaxon Holden

        If you’ve already bought them 3 times and are complaining about the notion of another purchase, then you shouldn’t want to buy them again and this won’t affect you. But lots of other people want to buy them.

        • RoseMFoust

          Google is paying 97$ per hour,with weekly payouts.You can also avail this.
          On tuesday I got a brand new Land Rover Range Rover from having earned $11752 this last four weeks..with-out any doubt it’s the most-comfortable job I have ever done .. It sounds unbelievable but you wont forgive yourself if you don’t check it
          !dw250d:
          ➽➽
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      • Aline Piroutek

        For 5$ each. A steal.

    • Ardisan

      Eh I rather just emulate them tbh, cant give two toads if its pirating or not (well unless its a indie game or a recent game).

      • Vigilante_blade

        I will continue piracy until they can convince me that I will keep them forever.

        • JasonBall

          If you download a game onto your system what’s the issue

          • Vigilante_blade

            Then a new console comes, I have to unplug the old one to make some space. I should be able to play the game I bought on any other Nintendo console that comet out in the future. Tie it to my account.

          • JasonBall

            Oh, so not keep it forever, have it ready to play forever. Thats not a problem limited to downloaded games though.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Perhaps, but with the existence of Steam, consoles have no excuse.

          • JasonBall

            Okay, except the fact that many consoles are built with totally different architecture. Do you really want every game ever on every console ever?

          • Vigilante_blade

            PC’s are built with different architectures. Steam makes it availiable on all of them.

          • JasonBall

            I think PCs have more similar architecture from gen to gen than Wii U and 3DS to Switch

          • Vigilante_blade

            Far from true. Many different architectures get made for PC every year.

          • JasonBall

            Do you really want every game on every console?

    • Tlink7

      And for it not to get two ”””””new””””” games every month πŸ˜›

    • Aline Piroutek

      We need Xbox Live Pass for Nintendo. Who thinks it is a bad idea?

    • MagcargoMan

      We still need a unified Virtual Console library.

      And make it so if you own a NES game on 3DS you can download it for free on Wii U and vice-versa.

  • Jacob Groves

    Cannot wait for Super Mario Oydssey, Xenoblade Chronicles 2, Fire Emblem Warriors, Skyrim, Doom, L.A. Noire, Sonic Forces, Rocket League, HOLLOW and few more Switch games I want before 2018 arrivals. πŸ˜€

  • Roto Prime

    Thank you for making the Switch about gaming first!!!!

    • Bart

      Couldn’t agree more, big part of the reason I love Nintendo, because their systems still feel like actual consoles, the way I want them.

  • Addy

    Reselling 1-3 year old last generation games is not solving the problem.

    • Loz Jam

      Right…. I’ll keep that in mind as I am playing Breath of the Wild, ARMS, Splatoon 2, Mario + Rabbids Kingdom Battle, Xenoblade Chronicles 2, Fire Emblem Warriors, and Super Mario Odyssey

      • FutureFox

        And Last of Us, GTA V, God of War and Tomb Raider Remake of remakes.

      • MagcargoMan

        You’ll keep that in mind while you imagine playing games that aren’t even out yet?

      • Addy

        I meant during the first six months. Also botw was also on the Wii U.

    • Aline Piroutek

      You saw how much sucess the last gen games on Switch made in compasion to new games like Splatoon 2.
      The ports aren’t system sellers, they a nice add to Switch’s library.

      • Addy

        But for those who already own the Wii U versions may not want to buy it again, especially at full price.

        “Oh, but it’s got extra content not available on the original and has all the DLC.”

        It’s still not worth the full price.

  • Mr. Oshawott

    When will Nintendo ever get around to implementing cross-gen/cross-console buying? I’m pretty sure most people don’t enjoy having to re-buy the same titles whenever they want to play them on a different console (or, in the case of the Wii Shop Channel, when support for earlier consoles is dropped).

    • Jaxon Holden

      And I’m sure developers don’t enjoy having to re-develop the same titles whenever consumers demand them for free just because they bought a new console.

    • Vigilante_blade

      Cross buy and cross gen should be a thing. Yes.

    • Androzz

      Even Sony didn’t do it with PS4, I can’t play my PS classics I bough in my PS3 on my PS4.

  • Ardisan

    Any reason why Bowsers telling us this? Is this how he gets the money for his castle?

    • DiscoGentleman

      His fat stacks of coins are in another castle.

  • What mistakes? The wiiu is perfect

    • Tlink7

      The perfect failure πŸ˜€

    • Aline Piroutek

      The only mistakes of WiiU: no games on the launch year, weird architecture.

      • Only mistakes of wiiu: no Sega Saturn Virtual Console

        • Aline Piroutek

          ;_;
          The only SEGA plataform without official emulation aside from Dreamcast.

    • Vigilante_blade

      The only mistake of the Wii U:

      – Low specs.
      – Too costly
      – Not enough hard drive space.
      – Slow startup.
      – Gamepad
      – Forced gimmicks
      – Paper Mario not learning its lesson.
      – Star Fox Zero is a horrendous game.
      – Lack fo third party support.
      – Games with little to no ambition
      – Filler games.
      – Dishonest advertising
      – Targeting casuals that left.

      • JasonBall

        I agree with just about everything there, but I have heard mostly good things about Paper Mario.

      • Androzz

        – Low specs: compared to what? remember Wii U launched a year before PS4/XBO, it had better hardware than PS3/XB360
        – Not enough hard drive space: It doesn’t use an HDD, it uses a SDD, quality over quantity.
        – Slow startup, it has basically a selection of game before even you start the system, how is that slow?
        – Gamepad: the gamepad is a godsend, I was finally able to play console games without a TV.
        – Forced gimmicks: Like what?
        – Paper Mario that’s a developer problem not the system problem.
        – Star Fox Zero is a horrendous game, you are exaggerating, SFZ is a great game, but some people disliked the controls, I personally didn’t had any problem with them, and also has nothing to so with the system itself.
        – Lack of third party support, it had 3rd party support the first year, but Nintendo fans don’t buy 3rd party stuff, that’s a fact.
        – Games with little to no ambition I guess Pikmin3, Zelda BotW, Bayonetta 2, XCX, W101, Sm4sh, MK8, HW had no ambition at all huh…
        – Filler games, what exactly is a filler game?
        – Dishonest advertising what? more like no advertising at all?
        – Targeting casuals that left, they didn’t even know who to target, it was a mess.

      • R.Z.

        I agree with 7/13, you get my upvote but just barely.
        πŸ˜›

        • Vigilante_blade

          Eh, I’ll take it.

  • Devlind

    Yes, they’re listening and stuff, but the problem is that what they’re doing right now should have been done 3 or 4 years ago. Sony and Microsoft are about to jump into another generation and third parties are going to jump with them. The Switch is incredible, yes, but at this pace it’ll be obsolete tech for AAA games in a couple of years, and we know that Nintendo systems don’t survive with only first party and indie games *cof cof Wii U cof cof*

    And yeah, third parties can make games for it if the user base is big enough, but that would lead us to other Wii situation. Barebones editions of big games, spin offs and shovelware.

    • nemo37

      I think Wii U was more of the exception than the rule. Nintendo has pretty much been the backbone of the software for their systems, which has in turn lead to higher hardware sales. The issue with Wii U was (and this is coming from someone that bought it at launch) that there were large gaps between releases. The first half of the Wii U’s launch year was pretty much devoid of any first-party content.

      I also think that because the Switch is a portable system, players understand that this is not going to be a triple-AAA powerhouse. We are likely not going to get many current gen triple-AAA stuff from PS4 and XONE, and we are most likely not going to get much of whatever ends up releasing on a future PS5 or Xbox. The portable nature of the Switch means that it will not have the power to ever match the same generation of stationary systems in terms of graphics, but it makes up for it in allowing players to take wherever they go. I think Switch has the potential to do well in its own way, thanks to the unique games it has and will continue to get from Nintendo and from Japanese studios as well as the portable nature of the hardware. In many ways, it is the ideal system for people that like Nintendo games and/or only play on the go; for these folks I expect it will be their only system (Wii U was partially cannobolized in this sense by the 3DS, which was cheaper, actually portable, and at the time was receiving new content while the Wii U for much of its life experienced long software droughts). For people that play on PS4, XOne, and PC the Switch can be a nice portable companion. For example, in PC online communities I have seen an uptake of Switch that far higher than any other Nintendo or non-Nintendo console or portable.

      Of course, it will be imperative for Nintendo to continue releasing a steady stream of software for Switch (they need to repeat what they have done 2017). In addition, I am still skeptical with the early-success of the system continuing largely because of the price. I hope Nintendo is ready for $50-$70 price cut should the system lose momentum. The price cut is what saved DS and 3DS after, respectively, the DS lost momentum early-on and the 3DS launched with weak sales. Nintendo never did a similar aggressive price cut with Wii U (they simply discontinued the basic model and sold the Deluxe bundle at the same price), which I feel along with marketing issues and lack of a stream of first-party content (not to mention the 3DS getting the vast majority of first-party content and coming in at a lower price) was what doomed that system. I think it is, however, quite possible for the Switch to be successful, if Nintendo continues to release good first-party, second-party, and some third-party exclusive content and sets a lower price point should they lose momentum. This is how past Nintendo systems have survived for the most part, even when they lack the same triple-AAA support as the other systems.

    • Aline Piroutek

      What if developers start devoloping for Switch first and porting to other consoles after?

    • R.Z.

      I agree about the soon to be outdated tech, but Nintendo has pulled similar things off with their previous handheld systems. No AAA games, sure, but third parties still released games and din’t complain, and unlike the Wii it wasn’t mostly shovelware.

      Plus I don’t really think the WiiU proved anything because it took it a looong while to have decent first party content and indie support and it was overpriced compared to similar systems.
      To me it’s what “killed it” rather than any other aspect.

  • nemo37

    The improvement in boot up times and the overall improvements in the responsiveness of the system was, at least in my opinion, a great step forwards. In addition, using clear advertising (you know like actually showing the system and not using names like “Wii U” and “3DS” where people would think of them as either iterations or adding to past devices) was also pretty helpful and I’m sure instrumental in the system’s initial success.

    However, there are still things they could vastly improve. For one thing, I feel their current online system is a step backwards compared to what was available on Wii U. Miiverse, which was a great way for players and friends to communicate and add each other, has been discontinued. There is still no universal chat system, and chatting is implemented in a case-by-case system and primarily facilitated through an app instead of an inbuilt system, hence you are required to use two devices (plus an accessory connecting their audio ports if you want to hear in-game sound and the people you are chatting with). What stings the most though is that we know the chat system does not need to be this way. Splatoon has shown us that we can chat using a headset just using the Switch, and PS Vita has shown us how a universal chat system can be implemented on a system that is far more resource constrained than the Switch. I feel by the time Nintendo launches their paid online system, we need the ability to add friends using their Nintendo Network ID (just like on Wii U; as opposed to having to use friend codes), we need at least an in-built chat system (ideally universal, since that is what the rest of the competition has), as well as an easy to use invite system for inviting friends to online game sessions. The other perks they can forgo considering they are charging less for the service.

    Moreover, the VC service, the ability to use wireless bluetooth headsets (there are literally open source BT Audio stacks that Nintendo can use), and the addition of video streaming services would also be greatly welcome.

    On top of that they absolutely need to continue with releasing first-party content in a timely manner. We cannot have droughts like we did in the Wii U and 3DS era.

    • MagcargoMan

      “you know like actually showing the system and not using names like “Wii U” and “3DS” where people would think of them as either iterations or adding to past devices”
      How was this any different from the NES and the SNES exactly?

  • Tlink7

    Yeah, no, the Wii U didn’t even have ”a glut” at the start. I’m so glad the Switch has all these games, the situation of its predecessor was just terrible.

    It is also super awesome I don’t have to wait ten minutes before I can play a game anymore, that actually put me off booting up my Wii U soooo many times lol

  • Locky Mavo

    The Switch overall has been a huge improvement to the Wii U in almost every way. Great games and much better and needed 3rd party support. But there are definitely still some improvements they need to do, their online, while it does “work”, they really need to make better, preferably before they start charging it.
    Still no VC, it’s been over 6 months now, it’s getting a bit beyond the joke.
    And 3rd party games, while I said it was better than the Wii U’s situation, I still think it can and should be better, there’s been few “why isn’t this coming to the Switch?” games announced recently, so they needs to get onto that. And then there’s devs telling people to port beg, while it’s great to see 3rd party devs keen to bring games to the Switch, but when they say “only if enough people cry out for it” or something along those lines, that’s just wrong.

    Still, I’m happy with how the Switch is so far, can’t believe we’re only a few days away from Mario Odyssey, then there’s also FE Warriors, DOOM, Skyrim, Xenoblade 2 this year, among other great games, I feel this has been the best first year for any console and I feel it’s only going to get better.

  • Vigilante_blade

    Okay, since absolutely no one answered this question when I tried to ask them, I will make a separate post:

    Why shouldn’t games give options to turn off motion inputs?

    • Didn’t you just asked that already…? Also…how do you live with yourself…?
      Considering the long-ass post/discussion down below….

      Anyways…to ANSWER your question. It all depends on the developer’s choice. Or, basically, it’s up to the developer’s of said games.

      Though, to be fair, I haven’t really kept a list of games to that offer that option. but I do know that Splatoon (on WiiU) did give you the option to use manual style of aiming and all. as oppose to motion-based aiming style.

      While in the past, in the Wii era, most Wii games would give you the option to use the Classic Controller and/or Gamecube Controller. Whether THAT counts as being equivalent to option to turn off motion controls is beyond me.

      But I ain’t gonna bother discussing that. But that much I’ll say. I guess…

    • masterjedi

      The answer is money. I costs money to produce multiple control schemes and at some point, technology dictates that older control styles no longer be utilized in favor of more modern technology.

      And creator intent is a valid argument. As the creator, why should I be forced to create something that you want specifically that is not what I want to create? That’s like saying a musician should be forced to make the music the consumer wants to hear instead of making the music they want to make. If the consumer chooses not to buy it that’s their choice but consumers do not get to dictate what a creator creates.

      This also goes back to the conversation that we were having earlier. If you’re talking about options, why are you not arguing for gamers who prefer the mechanical input of a d-pad to have the option to use it in every game? I asked you this earlier and your answer was “the analog stick is the evolution of the d-pad.” When I said motion control was the evolution of the analog stick you responded “motion control is not an evolution, its a mutation because its not a mechanical input.” You have a reason why I as a gamer who grew up with the d-pad should be forced to accept the analog stick, but you complain that you are being forced to accept motion controls. I don’t understand this logic other than you want what you want. I have no problem with you having a preference, but I don’t get why you seem to think my preference is less valid than yours.

      When the analog stick came out it was very hard for me to adjust to it. I was terrible at Goldeneye because I had a hard time with the analog stick. I wished that I could have used the d-pad instead. Now I have no problem using either. But per your logic, games that come out in 2017 should afford me the option of using the d-pad like games that came out in 1986 did simply because at one point in time, the d-pad is what I was used to and what I preferred. That’s not evolution, that’s stagnation.

  • awng782

    – A constant and steady flow of quality first party content, as well as key 3rd party collaborative titles
    – Appealing hardware and concept
    – Excellent marketing and advertising

    Nintendo needed to get those 3 things right to succeed. They did phenomenally with the Wii, failed spectacularly with the Wii U, and is doing great with the Switch.

  • MagcargoMan

    Well, they finally listened to long-suffering Metroid fans and announced two new games at E3 this year, os maybe they are listening. F-Zero next year perhaps?

  • I just hope that switch won’t die as fast as Wii U, this console has too big potential to make it go to waste

  • Gamingfan

    Liked the wii u but dont like the switch. The gamepad was a good controller imo and I dislike the joy cons. The switch is also overpriced if you just look at it as a console. Portability is irrelevant to me.

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  • Sister Porkpie

    Well. I’m glad they’re listening, anyway. But they still seem to be making questionable choices in some areas.