Reggie on the social competitive scene and Smash Bros., wanting to keep things at a grassroots level - Nintendo Everything

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Reggie on the social competitive scene and Smash Bros., wanting to keep things at a grassroots level

Posted on June 16, 2017 by (@NE_Brian) in General Nintendo, News

During a recent tournament, Juan “Hungrybox” Debiedma called Nintendo out with the following message:

“A certain company that acknowledges us but refuses to push us—I hope you’re listening right now, because I want you to hear this. I want you to hear the amount of people who support this league, the amount of people who want this to be a lifestyle for people. This is not just a video game. This is a lifestyle! All right?”

At E3, Kotaku showed Nintendo of America president Reggie Fils-Aime this speech. Here’s what he had to say in response:

“We’ve been in this social competitive space for a long time. Smash Bros. Melee has been a mainstay in the competitive gaming space for a long time. What we’re doing—and our take on his space is we want to encourage the community. We want to enable them to put on tournaments and to have fun and for the players themselves to participate in these types of situations. That’s our view of this space.”

“Look, we love Hungrybox. We had him in our tournaments. There is a passion in the Smash Bros. community which is fantastic. When he talks about lack of support, I’m not quite sure what he’s alluding to.”

“I will say this. Five, six, seven years ago, as we engaged with our developers and talked to them about Smash Bros. and what was happening, there was not a lot of understanding about this space. And it’s been people like [Nintendo of America’s] Bill Trinen and JC Rodrigo and all of these folks who understand the space that have helped us educate our company and educate our developers around the benefits of engaging with the community and empowering and enabling this to happen.It was with the most recent Smash Bros. that we’ve done more tournaments and we’re supporting both the Melee community as well as the Smash Bros. Wii U community and they’re both vibrant and are continuing to grow.”

“It’s community-oriented. It’s enabling the community to drive it forward. We have relationships, obviously, with entities like Evo and Battlefly. We want to do this much more at a grassroots level than others’ visions around leagues and big up-front payments and things of that nature.”

Kotaku has more on the story at the source link below, including additional comments from Hungrybox in which he clarifies remarks from his original speech.

Source

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  • Princess_Eevee9

    I think people don’t understand what they want. They want a game limb free Melee, but from a artistic standpoint as well as content wise we got that and more? Don’t get why people want a bad game when we have better?

    • Vigilante_blade

      Melee is techncially a better game form a competitive standpoint. Yes, Smash 4 has more content, but Melee has more quality content when it comes to speed, responsiveness, rewarding offense, and advanced techniques. People would like to have this return to the series.

      • MajoraMan28

        Please stop spreading your fanboyism and ignorance.

        I was a Melee elitist like yourself, and I actually got off my horse to see what was so great about Smash 4. Today I see them as rewarding different kinds of things, albeit both things being present in the gameplay of both Smash games. These things are offensive gameplay (Melee) versus tactical and more neutral game-based play (Smash 4). Smash 4 has a good number of advanced tech and loads of stuff that requires skill and less cheap stuff that Melee tends to reward (like not being able to punish Fox in the neutral when he messes up bc of his Shine). Not saying Melee is bad, but Melee is a less balanced and favors a different style of play.
        Saying Melee is technically a better game is you being a fanboy of a game you played in your teens and is proof that your nostalgia and fanboyism blinded you from accepting that Smash can be played differently (which it doesn’t mean it’s technically worse, only that Smash 4 pleases your “tastes” less than Melee).

        I could argue with you for a good ammount of time how Smash 4 is just as great and technical game as Melee, but I won’t waste my time. I’ve made my point clear, and I hope people reading this understand that they should give both games a chance, that both games are technical but different.

        • Vigilante_blade

          I do not consider myself an elitist. I simply prefer Melee to other games. Melee is objectively a better competitive game considering it attracts more people to competitions, survived the test of time, and is more entertaining to watch. Melee’s skill cieling is also much higher, and is more balanced than some think it is. Melee is also quite tactical, I don’t see how Smash 4 is any “more” tactical than Melee. You have mroe movement options in Melee, provisding you with a wider breadth of options to choose from.

          Furthermore, my childhood has little to do with it. I played Smash 64 first and much prefer Melee.

          I have no qualms with people playing how they want to play, hence why casual Melee play does not bother me in the slightest.

          Also, I,ve never claimed that Smash 4 had no technical things to it. Heck, Mario Party has technical aspects to it. It just has much less of it. It is slower, gives less options to players and as a whole, simply does not equate Melee’s depth.

          Again, please do not call me an elitist for having a preference and for saying facts.

          • Shonenfan

            If i was to say best fighting for beginners easy to use but also has technical aspects for expert players. Then it has to be smash 4. Guilty gear always been my #1 fighting game 🙂

          • Vigilante_blade

            I’m pretty sure a one-armed baby could play Melee without much trouble. GUilty gear is really good too though.

        • Kaine Morrison

          Smash 4 and Brawl are just too damned slow!
          Melee is nice and quick.
          If Smash 4 was sped up a bit, yeah, it’d be nearly perfect.
          Some of the fighters need some more strength to them as well. Link and Shiek in particular!

          • Ardisan

            Lol I see no problem with smash4’s speed, its fine the way it is. Brawl was a amazing game but since it has that rng trip mechanic people from the competitive scene claim it as the worst, people hack it, then it starts losing its identity and becomes a even more buggy mess for the sake of “speed”.

          • Vigilante_blade

            What bugs? If you refer to wavedashing,t hat wa sintentionally put in the game.

  • Tlink7

    So this guy is mad about Nintendo not supporting his tournament? Or?

  • ronin4life

    Because the big leagues are all corrupt.

    Nintendo has never played ball with large groups be they lobbyists or anyone else (outside the increasingly defunct ESA…) that tend to make outrageous demands and enforce needless policy restrictions when Nintendo can take their ball and play without them.

  • Vigilante_blade

    This is so vague, I’m not even sure I understand it. However, oen way Nintendo could aid in this is to make the next Smash closer to Melee in fighting style. I mean, let’s be honest, Melee is the best game in the series for many reasons. I think they really should just go full ham on redirecting this franchise to soemthing everyone can enjoy. A Melee-style game with tons of content for casual gamers.

    • Jack Red

      Or why not if possible, a Melee mode in Smash 5. Please both sides of the spectrum. The Melee mode with omega stages and no items four stock, while the main mode has all items, various unique stages and with any game rules.

      • Vigilante_blade

        Melee fans don’t like omega stages though. Final Destination is not a very good level for competitions. Honestly, I think they should just make Smash 5 with Melee physics. Party smashers won’t mind either way. it will please both camps. Also, with your idea, you should be able to use everything in Melee mode too. What if I want to play on crazy stages with Melee physics?

        • Jack Red

          There are also people who prefer each Smash Bros to be unique in it’s own way. Melee wasn’t like Smash 64, Brawl wasn’t like Melee or Smash 64, and Smash 4 isn’t like Brawl, Melee or Smash 64. So why should Smash 5 suddenly go back to Melee’s physics only?

          • Vigilante_blade

            Mostly because it was the only game that wa senjoyed by both parties. I’m okay with other physics modes existing, but Melee is simply the one that everyone liked.

          • Jack Red

            I’ve played it, and to me, It is fun, but I feel like Melee’s gameplay physics should stay with Melee. On a different note, what the heck was with the whole Onii-chan weirdness? Were you expecting something Anime/Fire Emblem related for E3?

          • Vigilante_blade

            Oh, I explained it a while back. I wa sin the unoficial NE discord and we starting discussing really random things, and it ended up with onii chan memes. It was late, I was tired and felt like messing around, so I just temporarily changed my username, posting memes. Since the reactions were so funny, I decided to keep going for a bit.

            Personally, I feel Melee’s physics should never have left.

          • Jack Red

            Oh. As for Melee’s physics shouldn’t have ever left, that could be applied to any other fighting games that gets different physics from the previous entries. I feel like each fighting game should freely go for whatever physics that they’d like, It gives variety. Otherwise, it would just be a case of Street Fighter’s constant different versions of 2, 3, and 4.

          • DeltaPeng

            I like Melee’s playstyle a lot, a lot of fun crazy skill shot moments, and it always feels very satisfying to pull off. On the other hand, I felt Smash 4 was a pretty good happy medium between being competitive and being accessible.

            In Melee, if you know what you’re doing, a new or moderate leveled player doesn’t really stand any chance of winning. The mechanics are such that skill gaps are much more evident, as it takes fewer hits and hence less mistakes can be made before you’re done-zo.

            In Smash 4, it is harder to be KO’d and so there’s generally more opportunities to make a comeback and react, yet it still plays fairly well competitively. The blend was good/great to help broaden the audience and general appeal of the game.

            Rather than a full fledged new game, a Smash Melee HD remaster (on the Switch) would be sweet. Throw in a few new characters and that could keep people busy for awhile. The Switch would allow you to 1v1 throwdown anywhere. Then ideally, maybe WiiU pro controller support on Switch or a new wireless wavebird style GC controller, but I’m going pretty heavy in the wishlist/dream/unlikely-to-happen territory here.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Personally, I think that a skilled player should never lose. It is unfair for a skilled player who put time and effort to get better to lose against someone who barely picked up the game.

            Besides, I would argue for some tools to help newcomers. For exmaple, new controllers have an extra shoulder button. Have one of them be a wavedash button. So now, the wavedash input is “Hold direction, tap button”. The old way would remain, but the new way would allow newcomers to keep up a bit without being handed an effortless victory.

            I don,t just want Melee HD. I played Melee to death. I want a sequel, a Melee 2.

  • Fredy Rodriguez Ortega

    can somebody translate me what did Reggie mean?

    • Vigilante_blade

      As I understand, HungryBox would want Melee’s competitive scene to grow enough to become a career like Capcom does with its games, or Blizzard does with its own games.

      Reggie is back-pedaling, saying that they used to not support the scene as all, but now they are. However, they won’t go the extra mile to allow this to become a career.

      • Fredy Rodriguez Ortega

        well at least they progressing

        • Vigilante_blade

          It’s complicated. The only reason they even acknowledge us is because we are loud. They tried to get rid of us before, so it’s a bit of a rough relationship.

      • Kaine Morrison

        Playing a video game is not a career and never should be one.

        • Vigilante_blade

          Why not? Athletes made baseball, Hockey and football a career.

          • Snackster1001

            Yes, but simply winning at a video game isnt a reason for a paycheck. Players are a brand, they are paid by TEAMS (not the NBA/NFL/WHATEVER) to play and promote that team and its merchandise. Unless you have an interesting personality/dedicated following, you wont get sponsored as a smasher because you barely promote any merch in gameplay outside of a jersey. People shouldnt be asking nintendo for “livings”, but instead to promote and help the competitive scene more, allowing the fanbase to broaden so more sponsorships are possible (and thus, more opportunity to live off sponsorship)

          • Vigilante_blade

            So we should ban all sports in your logic.

          • Snackster1001

            You completely missed the damn point. Im glad you dont run anything in esports

          • Vigilante_blade

            No, esports is literally atheticism. There is a reaosn sports visas are being emitted for this endeavour.

          • Snackster1001

            And so is chess. I can get a sports visa for playing chess. The definition of sports is so obscure st this point that it has lost any meaning outside of doing something competitively. And that’s not what im referring to, im referring to the fact that you think getting paid by developers for being good at their game instead of teams/sponsors with developer promotion is a brilliant idea.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Esports is publicity in fact. There is a reason why companies provide prize pools for their games at EVO, or why League of Legends is using it. It’s profitable to do so.

          • Kaine Morrison

            Medical expeneses.
            Retirement funds.
            All of that and others.
            No gaming company will bother with that.
            If you need “off time” for a medical issue or a personal “like these idiots even have lives” they will be replaced by the next in line.
            What happens when video gaming crashes like the 70s and 80s?
            What happens when they get old?
            They are all screwed!

          • Vigilante_blade

            Okay. But where is your argument? You really come off as an anti-gamer bro.

          • Kaine Morrison

            Says the overweight couch potato.
            Athletes are out in the sun and get plenty of sun.
            The only excersize you get is in your thumbs and your jaw!

          • Velen (Not WoW)

            Now we’ve resorted to name calling.

            You lose.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Actually, competitive esports is extremely demandig if you want to reach the top. The best players will practice for many hours, constantly. Their limits will be tested, both mentally and physically. These people reach a point where they can do over ten inputs in a single second. Competitive gamers are both physical and mental athletes.

          • Kaine Morrison

            Hahahahaha…. 10 inputs a second!
            Lets see them walk 10 feet without stopping to catch their breath!

          • Vigilante_blade

            I would expect this kind of comment from an ignorant bro-dude who doesn’t play games; not from someone who frequenting gaming website.

            If you cannot see the physical prowess required for pro gaming, you are truly ignorant of the amount of physical strain competitive gaming can have on your body and mind.

            Before you comment on things, how about learning about them? Why not spend a year trying a competitive circuit?

          • Kaine Morrison

            The only ones doing this are milennials.
            They have no skills, be it real work or social.
            They all still live at home on mommy and daddy’s dime.

            Watch what happens in 10 years, hell, even 5!
            Nintendo won’t and doesn’t stand for it. And rightly so.
            They make no money off of it.
            The players use modded, downloaded versions of the games. They use emulators and roms. None of that is going to nintendo.
            They aren’t advertising nintendo or their products like they should be.

            Sony and Microsoft, will soon follow suit.

          • Vigilante_blade

            Almost every higher caliber Melee players are well into their thirties. Hungrybox for example is an accomplished engineer.

            I have also been juggling an academic and tournament life at a younger age., and I am 30 years old.

            And what the heck does roms have to do with the current matter at hand? You are currently showing casual elitism. Just because you lack the drive to gain any gaming ability doesn’t mean you should look down on those that have the passion for it. They are entertainers. They work hard to become the best. You on the other habd decide to look down on it.

            Sports are exactly the same. Novelists, painters, TV hosts… By your standard, these people are useless. You are showing severe intolerance and bigotery towards something you hardly even understand.

          • Kaine Morrison

            Novelists create
            Painters create
            Some tv show hosts create. I personally care for none of them.
            Sports, real sports, further their sport.

            Roms are theft

          • Vigilante_blade

            Buddy, we re talking about competitive gaming, not roms. You are naking zero sense. Those two things are not even remotely connected.

            And sure, gamers create new plays. They also create content for people to spectate. Again, pro gaming is a physically and mentally demanding thing. It is no different from any other sport.

        • Hidden Flare

          Have to disagree, as much as I don’t understand it, competitive gaming is something that doesn’t hurt to have a sort of job around seeing it does require thought and skills to move in game.

          Also just pointing out, reviews, let’s players, and other video game related media is a job sooooo video games are already a career.

  • NintendoPSXTheSecond

    Seems fine to me. Sakurai is probably the one saying to Nintendo’s branches not to acknowledge Smash as a competitive massive presence. You see Nintendo host their own Splatoon tournies across the globe while TPCi handles any and all Pokemon related tournaments. We’re already seeing some Nintendo ARMS tournies (Though I’m not sure if ARMS has the legs to stand up in the FGC community).
    So really it’s just Smash they don’t intervene. I mean, who could blame them? Smash has SO many different companies, legal copyrights and such. To host such massive tournies for Smash they must have to ask every company every time like SEGA, PG*, Capcom, GameFreak, Intelligent Systems, etc., and that’s just a pain and depending on those companies the money to run or the legal tender to use these character’s in promotions, art, etc., could be more than Nintendo is willing to push.
    So in their eyes it’s easier to let the people who want it to fund it while Nintendo just gives the thumbs up from the back.

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  • Valid points, but I just can’t like Hungrybox after how he acted at the 2015 NWC. He just came off like a real a**, and spoiled what was supposed to be a lighthearted moment.

    • Vigilante_blade

      I thought he was pretty funny.

      • Hidden Flare

        What did he do exactly?

        • Vigilante_blade

          He sort of went up to Reggie and challenged him to a match. It was all fun and games.

          • Hidden Flare

            Oh I remembered that. The one where Reggie failed bad. XD that wasn’t horrible or bad and it felt like they were just playing around or having fun.

    • Hidden Flare

      What did he do?

      • He just made some offhanded trash talking to Reggie afterwards, but to me it just came off as overly aggressive and disrespectful when Reggie was clearly being more playful in tone with what he was saying.

  • Pepperkeet

    I don’t care for Esports personally so this whole thing seems pointless, Nintendo has been supporting tournaments and stuff lately and that’s a good sign.
    MAYBE they’re late to the party but just look at what they did at E3, I won’t sit here and fault them for doing the right thing even if it was a tad late.

  • Kenshin0011

    I’m hopeful that we’ll get an amazing January Direct featuring announcements like Smash Bros Switch, Pikmin 4, No More Heros, and more!

  • Snackster1001

    Look, I love competitive smash (compete/watch 4, watch melee), but I have to agree with reggie in some cases. Nintendo gains nothing from handing out huge checks for winning tournaments. Melee promotes no current products and smash 4 isnt that huge yet in esports (though it is growing). What people dont realize is nintendo sponsors some major tourneys now (which in turn makes set ups and equipment less of a burden on TOs). That should be payment enough to keeo the community growing (granted, they should sponsor MORE tourneys). Payments for top players should be settled with esport sponsors, not Nintendo.

    HOWEVER, nintendo should promote the community and their tournaments more to increase their viewers(which we see signs of with their versus twitter account).